Vancouver’s Mayor, Ken Sim, is a real Bitcoin fanatic who’s doing his half to get Vancouver’s metropolis council in addition to its residents to see what he sees in the case of Bitcoin.
And his efforts are beginning to bear fruit.
On December 11, 2024, the Vancouver Metropolis Council greenlit a movement Mayor Sim ready to start out making Vancouver a extra Bitcoin-friendly metropolis.
The movement directs metropolis employees to discover the concepts of Vancouver establishing a strategic bitcoin reserve in addition to accepting taxes and metropolis charges in bitcoin.
In my dialog with Mayor Sim, we mentioned the passing of this movement in addition to a few of his deeper philosophical ideas about Bitcoin.
We additionally touched on what Bitcoin adoption in Vancouver would seem like in an ideal world, his personal journey down the proverbial Bitcoin rabbit gap and why Bitcoin can convey monetary hope to the residents of Vancouver at a time limit when many are struggling to make ends meet.
The Vancouver Metropolis Council lately handed your movement to make Vancouver a extra Bitcoin-friendly metropolis.
On a private degree, although, in the event you might wave a magic wand and allow no matter degree of Bitcoin adoption you see slot in Vancouver, what would that seem like?
I’ve received to present you a caveat right here. These are my very own private views. We’ve a reasonably unbelievable workforce on the Metropolis of Vancouver, and so they’ve been tasked to discover. So, it is not as if I can actually affect the workforce and inform them “It’s important to do that and that.”
In an ideal world, the very first thing we’d do is add to a strategic reserve. The second factor could be permitting individuals to transact with bitcoin with out triggering capital features tax occasions and to just accept funds within the type of bitcoin. Tax regulation throughout not simply Canada, however within the U.S. and lots of different jurisdictions, nonetheless hasn’t caught up, so each time you transact with bitcoin, there’s a capital features tax charge, which could be very cumbersome.
The third factor is that we begin the dialog and we bust the myths round narratives like Bitcoin is unhealthy for the atmosphere. That is all hogwash, proper? Bitcoin is definitely going to assist us save the atmosphere.
Plus, it supplies us with an immutable file and it really provides to a degree of transparency we have by no means seen within the historical past of humankind. Having that included into our techniques could be nice.
You spoke about this course of of teaching individuals about Bitcoin on Natalie Brunell’s present. You stated you “bathe them with love and you then hit them with information.” Are you able to give an instance of what this appears like?
There’s lots of resistance with Bitcoin, particularly because it pertains to its perceived results on the atmosphere. Individuals hear this narrative that it is unhealthy for the atmosphere, and it is like, “Nicely, wait a second…”
I am an environmentalist, and I do know that in the event you drive organizations throughout the planet to do stuff that they don’t seem to be incentivized to do, nothing’s going to occur. Whereas in the event you incentivize them — in the event you construct in a reward system — it’s wonderful.
So, what do we all know? Nicely, we flare pure fuel as a by-product of oil manufacturing, and if we really seize that and repurpose it for Bitcoin mining, it’s really good for the atmosphere. Similar with capturing methane that seeps from the bottom.
Additionally, with various or inexperienced vitality sources, be it wind energy or solar energy, the place the economics typically do not pan out to construct these initiatives, you present somebody with a assured buyer within the type of Bitcoin miners, and the economics work and this stuff get constructed. So, it is web optimistic for the atmosphere.
There’s additionally this false narrative that nefarious issues occur with Bitcoin. That is rubbish, proper? Money is untraceable. With Bitcoin, we’re speaking about an immutable file the place you may see each single transaction because the starting of time and you may catch individuals on the on and off ramps.
Among the narratives are literally the exact opposite of actuality, and so we now have to counter these narratives.
Primarily based on my expertise, it is simple to show somebody one thing, whereas it is lots tougher for individuals to unlearn, and we’re within the technique of serving to individuals unlearn what they’ve realized.
You could have referred to Bitcoin as the best invention in human historical past. May you develop on that?
Our cash is damaged. Individuals cannot use it to retailer their vitality into the longer term. We’re on this rinse and repeat cycle. In Ray Dalio’s guide The Altering World Order, he talks concerning the rise and fall of the Dutch empire, the rise and fall of the British empire, the rise and, as he places it, fall of the U.S. empire. Should you agree with Dalio’s perspective, the purpose is that the cash’s damaged.
We shouldn’t have a reserve forex that is ever lasted. We maintain repeating historical past. However Bitcoin modifications all that. As everyone knows, you may’t mess with it, and you may’t manipulate it. It is a game-changer and once we lastly get onto the bitcoin normal — I feel it is a matter of when, not if — it is going to change how people work together with one another and the way nation states evolve.
You simply cited one among Ray Dalio’s books, and I’ve heard you focus on the way you’ve additionally learn books like The Bitcoin Normal and Layered Cash. You’re additionally a buddy of Jeff Sales space’s. With all of the studying you’ve finished and the conversations you’ve had with Jeff, did you find yourself having a lightbulb second with Bitcoin or was it extra of a gradual studying course of?
Nicely, I had the other of the lightbulb second when my son Mitchell got here as much as me and stated “Dad, I wish to purchase bitcoin.” And I used to be like, “You contact that shit, and I will punch you within the throat.” Clearly, I wasn’t going to try this.
Then, I began seeing extra of it and had conversations with Jeff. So, I began to look into it, learn a bunch about it and went to a few conferences. My journey was similar to lots of different individuals’s. I used to be utterly in opposition to it after which I warmed as much as it and ultimately turned an evangelist.
I am unable to level to anybody level the place it was like, “Wow, there you go” and I went 180 levels the opposite manner. I do bear in mind although, I made my first $500 buy of bitcoin on November the 14th, 2020. The explanation it took me so lengthy was I needed to discover ways to use the app on which I purchased the bitcoin. It was all clunky — only a ache within the butt.
However I do not forget that day, as a result of after I lastly purchased it I believed, “Did I miss out?” I feel I purchased it at like 16 or 17 grand and it had run from like seven or eight grand the month earlier than. I used to be like, “Did I miss it?” I bear in mind Jeff saying, “No, you’re nonetheless tremendous early; we’re all nonetheless tremendous early.”
You’ve talked about how unaffordable housing in Vancouver is. Does bitcoin repair this?
Sure. Let me provide you with an instance. We’ve a small studio rental up in Whistler (a city north of Vancouver). Once we purchased it, it might have price 17.2 bitcoin. That is about 4 years in the past. When it comes to {dollars}, the property is up 36%, however when it comes to bitcoin, it is down one thing like 85%. As of as we speak, it prices like 3.3 bitcoin to purchase it.
By the way in which, I am not giving funding recommendation. I am simply speaking a couple of theoretical, if this performs out the way it might. If in some unspecified time in the future within the not so distant future, you can purchase a home in Vancouver for a bitcoin, what meaning is you may actually purchase a home for about US$106,000 or about CA$150,000 in the event you purchased a bitcoin as we speak.
I am not telling individuals to take out a mortgage to purchase bitcoin — very removed from it. Go search monetary recommendation. However in the event you consider bitcoin’s value will proceed to understand, you may actually purchase a home for CA$150,000 within the close to future by shopping for a bitcoin proper now.
You have introduced Bitcoin, a taboo topic, into the fold as Mayor of Vancouver, and also you’ve stated that doing so would possibly result in your not getting re-elected. Have you ever ever thought-about that the other could be true, that perhaps by embracing Bitcoin the individuals of Vancouver will wish to re-elect you?
I am not too involved about that. I’ve no need to be a premier or prime minister. I am not a politician, despite the fact that I am sitting on this position, which I actually honor, worth and take very critically. However the objective was by no means to be widespread. The objective was by no means to get re-elected. The objective was to do what I believed is true for the way forward for the Metropolis of Vancouver.
And so I could not sit again any longer and ignore this as a result of I really consider that this units the town up for the following hundred years. Am I proper? We do not know, however we now have a reasonably good feeling, and I really consider in it.
I feel voters, residents — it does not matter what facet of the political spectrum you sit on — are sick of politicians who do stuff simply to get re-elected. They need individuals to do what they consider is true, and I consider that is proper. If we do not get re-elected due to it, I can personally maintain my head up excessive and say, “You realize what? We caught to our values and we did what’s proper.” If it really works out, nice. I really assume it is going to work out, although.
It looks as if a progressive metropolis like Vancouver — the primary metropolis in Canada to have a Bitcoin ATM — must be in favor of Bitcoin. Nevertheless, the earlier mayor tried to ban Bitcoin ATMs within the metropolis. Was there a response from the Vancouver group when the mayor did this?
I did not comply with it too carefully on the time, so I do not know. I am unable to touch upon it. What I can touch upon is we do have lots of politicians who will make coverage up primarily based on advantage signaling versus knowledge. We’re an information pushed administration, and we care concerning the future prosperity of our metropolis.
I feel the excellence right here is we select to have probably the most affect — we’re extra involved concerning the steak than the sizzle. If somebody could make an argument on why it is a unhealthy concept primarily based on knowledge, we’ll take heed to it. We would have it unsuitable, however I can inform you nobody has been capable of assault our Bitcoin stance with knowledge.
Bitcoin could be form of tough to make use of technically. So, for instance, in an ideal world, perhaps Bitcoin turns into authorized tender in Vancouver in some unspecified time in the future, or if there’s simply larger adoption of it, do you are worried concerning the technical difficulties related to utilizing Bitcoin? Would the Vancouver metropolis authorities ever get entangled in educating its Vancouver residents about Bitcoin?
It isn’t one of many core providers we offer as a metropolis, so I do not see us taking place the tutorial rabbit gap. We’ll depart it as much as different consultants.
If the trade makes Bitcoin easier to make use of, so many extra teams and people will simply hop on the bandwagon. And you recognize it is coming as a result of there are lots of people engaged on this proper now.
I am not an skilled, however after I, after I hear about among the issues which might be occurring on Layer 2s and the Lightning Community, I see a future the place that is seamless. When individuals go right into a Walgreens and so they purchase a sweet bar, they received’t take into consideration how they’re paying with Bitcoin. All of the plumbing beneath will occur with out them realizing, and it is going to revolutionize the planet.
You have finished a handful of interviews on this subject up to now. Is there something that we within the media haven’t requested you but that you just’d like to debate or level out?
Sure, I’d wish to make a basic name out and never only for the town of Vancouver. It is for each single metropolis and province and state and jurisdiction and canton, and nation on the planet.
We’ve to get the schooling on the market, which continues to be a tough problem. Some individuals within the media have made the remark that what we’re doing proper now could be extra advantage signaling, as a result of we now have the hope of creating this occur. That is incorrect, although.
We want Bitcoin supporters to start out pumping the true narrative of why bitcoin is a sound monetary asset. It is the very best performing asset within the final 16 years on the planet. And we’re not merchants, so in the event you’re not trying to day commerce, the entire volatility does not matter.
We have to begin getting that narrative out, however not from me, from the group. We have to let our elected officers know this as a result of they are not going to do something till individuals hit them with knowledge and inform our flesh pressers that they need this.
We’re doing this as a result of we consider in it. We wish to get forward of it. We wish to arrange the town for the following 100 years, and that is why we’re keen to take political threat to do that. However we’d like assist. So, in case your viewers will help us push that narrative with our provincial authorities and of their jurisdictions, as effectively, that might be nice.
If individuals come onboard and see how bitcoin can cut back among the monetary stress of their lives, do you assume Vancouver transforms right into a pro-Bitcoin metropolis comparatively shortly?
Sure.
I am going again to my sister-in-law, who if she watches the video she’s gonna punch me within the face. About 13 years in the past, she was afraid of getting an iPhone. She did not perceive the expertise. It was a psychological block.
Then, she jumped on the bandwagon like everybody else, as a result of all her buddies had iPhones. It is ridiculous now to assume that folks had been afraid of iPhones, proper?
Will Bitcoin give us hope? Completely.
I am going again to the Metropolis of Vancouver and why that is so necessary. The Metropolis of Vancouver exists in the identical circumstances as everybody else does. Whereas individuals cannot afford a house or they’re scuffling with groceries, we now have a funds.
We’ve to rent cops, firefighters, engineers, and we’re dwelling in an atmosphere the place our forex is getting debased and we will not improve taxes at a charge that retains up with that. We do not wish to lower providers, and so Bitcoin provides us hope the place we will repair our monetary state, our steadiness sheet.
And that can really assist us run this metropolis for the following hundred years. I feel when individuals perceive Bitcoin and so they begin to undertake it, they’ll have hope, as effectively, as a result of they’ll notice their buying energy goes up, which is a good factor.
